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Episode 15: Military and Mindful, Lessons in Balancing Your Career and Family Life

Listen to Episode 15 of Sheepdog Financial HERE!

On this episode of Sheepdog Financial, Scott sits down with Benefsheh Verell, a military spouse, mom, author, and just recently retired from the Army herself. Benefsheh practices yoga, meditation, and advocates that the Army teaches meditation and mindfulness practices in basic training. believing this would help prepare soldiers for the stress of the military, family life, and the trauma they may face. 

This is a conversation about taking care of the mind as well as the body. It's about learning to live in the moment and increasing your quality of life. She has been there and felt the stress and loneliness. She found a way of coping and has made it her mission to teach others to endure.

Intro:                    Welcome to Sheepdog Financial. You will get answers to your financial questions. Learn to plan for your financial future and have the type of life that people dream of brought to you by Trisuli Financial Advising, a fiduciary financial advisor practice focused on military members and their finances. Your host of Sheepdog Financial is Scott Vance.

Scott:                   Today on Sheepdog Financial, we have Benefsheh Varel on the show Benefsheh, is a mother, author, spouse, and recently retired from the army. She practices meditation and advocates at the army start teaching meditation and mindfulness practices and basic training to prepare soldiers for the stress of the military, daily life, and any trauma they may face in the line of duty. She's a member of the board of directors of Warriors at Ease, an organization founded to bring the power of yoga and meditation to the military community through advocacy and around the world through advocacy, training and partnerships. Benefsheh, welcome to the show.

Benefsheh:          Thank you so much for having me. It's really exciting, so I'm glad to be here.

Scott:                   Awesome. I'm glad to have you. Your book Military and Mindful was recently released. What drove you to write your book and what did you learn along the way?

Benefsheh:          Well, after I retired from the military, I spent a good deal of time trying to figure out what I wanted to do with my life and I thought that I would start a travel business. So I went through a lot of challenges with that. But one of the things I wanted to do was write a book on mindful travel and I didn't know how to write a book. So I hired a consultant to, to help me at least structure the book figure out what goes into writing a, a book like this. And we actually did a meditation about our books and envisioning our books. And so when we did that, I realized that my book wasn't going to be about to travel at all. Right. That the, I mean, I, I love to travel, but that wasn't necessarily my passion. My passion is bringing mindfulness practices to the military. And so it became clear that I needed to tell my story about my journey to mindfulness. And that's what this book is about.

Scott:                   Well, yeah, it's almost like, you know, people talk about nicknames and I've found people that, you know, they say, Oh, this is going to be my nickname, but you don't really pick your nickname. It kind of picks you, which is kind of how you got into writing a book about being military and mindful. That's, it's a rough comparison.

Benefsheh:          But that makes sense. I, I agree that like, yeah, the book tells me because I was going in and gung ho on else completely. And this is what resulted in the journey just sort of unfolded.

Scott:                   So in your book, you just probably discuss a little about controlling stress and guilt. So what do you advocate as far as how for people to be have less stress in their lives and deal with the guilt of missing things or, you know, be in a military family and stuff like that?

Benefsheh:          Yeah. Well, one of the things that really I had to, to deal with or to learn, and sometimes I'm still learning is that I can't control outside and external factors. I can only control my actions, what I choose to think about, what I focus on. So trying to control my kids to get them to do what I think they should be doing or my husband or when I was working the, the people at work is not possible and it is a waste of my energy. So just having that understanding right there was like a huge really, cause I know that if I'm going to work, I can't control the coworkers and in what type of day they're having, but I can focus on my reaction to them and if I'm choosing to take everything that I've been saying as a personal attack on me or if I realize that not everything is about me, so perhaps they don't say hello to me after I've said hello, but you know, they could be having a bad day. I don't know what's going on with them. Everyone has their own story. So focusing on my own reaction to things that are happening, maybe altering my perception about an event. Like I said, realizing that everything is not about me. And then just choosing what I think to focus on. So if an event is happening, for example, I'm stuck in traffic or somebody cuts me off, I don't need to focus on that person, that that's cutting me off. I can choose to focus on something else that's happening around me. And that's what I, I really, I learned to do. I, there's a story that I like to tell. I this was when I lived in DC, so man, I don't know, a decade ago or so and so the traffic there is really very bad. So I was on 495 and there was this individual, this man that was just weaving in and out of traffic and like purposely cutting people off. It looked like he was enjoying all too. And it's, of course you cut me off and I got so angry like I, I, and, and, and I didn't let it go because I hadn't, you know, didn't have these tools and skills yet. So I, I proceeded to follow him and I was like tailgating him, just as he had been tailgating me. And I then started weaving in and out of traffic and you know, car staying and gestures. And I was actually driving very dangerous. And thankfully I came to my senses and I was like, Whoa, Whoa, Whoa. I know I'm going to hurt someone if I continue to do this. But the fact that I went from like zero to 60 based on somebody else, you know, that I let that person control my behavior instead of taking charge and being like, okay, the guys in a hurry, I don't know what his problem is. I don't care. I wish him well. I'm just gonna hang back here and not engage and, and we have that choice. And I, you know, I did not to wisely in that instance.

Scott:                   Well, and so we'll talk a little bit about being your book, military and mindful. Probably it'd be good to give people a definition to understand what mindfulness meditation you know, if you'd like me old school, I spent a year in Nepal working at the U S embassy. There was a lot of people that would come there for training and I just remember seeing them and like flowy pants with shirts that are with bright colors. So I guess I guess can you lay that groundwork for what mindfulness and meditation is and have it had a practice that I guess,

Benefsheh:          Yeah, absolutely. I will tell you that I, I is, I did my 200 hour yoga teacher training with Kripalu Institute for yoga and health in Lenox, Massachusetts. And so I had actually taken 30 days of leave to go and do the a month immersion. And when I got there, some of the things that we did would seem so foreign to me is like coming from a military background, I was like, Ooh, no way I can go back to my unit and start doing this stuff. So you're right. In some instances it seems very foreign to people coming from the military just based on, on how we operate. And so I had to take one, I learned and adapt it to what made sense or what felt right and relevant for me. And so mindfulness is really just the practice of being present in the moment with the mind and the body. A lot of times, you know, I've noticed, especially for myself in the past, I'll be sitting in a meeting, but my mind is thinking about something else entirely, like the grocery list, perhaps what I want to do on vacation, what I forgot to do and need to do. So I'm not actually in the meeting with my mind listening to the person that's speaking or on some cases that I would, I don't do this anymore. I used to, when someone was talking to me, if I thought that they were boring or that I wasn't interested in what they were saying and I would make this assessment within 15-20 seconds of them speaking to me, I would just go off and start thinking about something else and then pop back in and be like, are they now interesting? And then go off again. And I mean subconsciously I'm probably setting off signals and I'm not fully present. And because even if they aren't consciously aware of that, it still comes across and it's very rude. So just, any activity that helps you to practice the art of being present in the mind and the body is, is useful. And that's what yoga and meditation aim to do. And so meditation does not have to be sitting in silence for 20 or 30 minutes. That's really hard to do for people that are just starting out. I mean, I still even now will just be like, okay, let me do two minutes, two minutes of being present and I'll set a timer. And even that can be excruciating trying to, every time that I start thinking about something else, bring my attention back to the breath or sensation in my body. And it's just, it's training the mind to just stay in the present moment. It's like training a puppy because really our minds are our that distracted. We can think thousands of thoughts in a day. And so meditation will help you over time to be aware of what it is you are thinking and slow down those thoughts.

Scott:                   I had never really, you know, I had, like I said, I was in Nepal. I saw all these people come. I guess they would go off to these retreats and spend hours meditating, sitting cross legged. Yeah. I would just shake my head. And then, so I was reading through some stuff and reading through actually found an article on stars and stripes that you had been interviewed for and you advocate for basically teaching mindfulness from basic training.

Benefsheh:          Yes, I do. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and the reason for this is that we do have us do aside crisis in our, our military, you did it not only with our active duty but with our veterans and the numbers of suicide in the past year seemed to be going up in all services. And I mean there's many different reasons for that, but the, what we deal with as active duty service members or reservist with just our daily jobs, there was a lot of stress and responsibility and this doesn't include family life, our own backgrounds where people may have come from. So we, we come into the military and then now we're having to do all these different, learn all these different skills and then possibly deploy. Now even you may even have people that we're in charge of, and so it's a lot to take on and the military does a really very good job of physical fitness training us to be physically fit, training us in our jobs. So we learn how to use our weapons. We learned technical skills to perform our job and I think that they need to improve on the mental skills, giving us mental training so that we can be at our top game all of the time or most of the time, learning how to train our minds to deal with what we're facing, to, to understand that we're in the present moment and everything around us. We can't control, but let me focus on what I, what I can control and just to stay present so that we can be at optimal performance and meditation, mindfulness skills, breathing practices, these things, these tools help in these aspects.

Scott:                   I have PTSD and other probably the best thing I ever did was start journaling, which is not meditation, but I found that helpful more than the the pills they gave me, if that makes any sense. So.

Benefsheh:          No, it, it does, it really does. And just giving someone, giving them another option, especially for those that are suffering from PTSD. Another option besides turning directly to drugs...

Scott:                   Right,

Benefsheh:          ...is what I would like to see. And I think they, the military and the VA, they are using meditation and yoga to help in the treatment of PTSD and they have seen positive results. But I, I'm advocating that they also bring those practices as just a regular mental fitness program.

Scott:                   Yeah, it makes sense. A little bit of prevention of sprint will save a whole bunch of work on the backside of trying to fix them.

Benefsheh:          I agree. It could and it doesn't cost anything to facilitate a meditation.

Scott:                   Right.

Benefsheh:          Pressing play on a device and there you go. Yeah. Yeah.

Scott:                   I'd imagine probably the people that are the decision makers or have no way a whole bunch of requirements typical for the army and they're just trying to think of how they add this in. So I'd imagine this could be a minimal amount of time that would have pretty big payoffs other than the backside.

Benefsheh:          You're right. And it's good that you brought that up because my husband, when I was talking to him about trying to incorporate yoga and meditation, he was like, there is, there are so many training requirements that a commander thinking about how they're going to add in one more thing that you're making me do now, but you're not taking anything else away. And that's where it just becomes in the too hard to do factor. But what I was also, what that made me think about was, well, let's not try to add in some online meditation training or something that they have to check the block on. And now this is another training requirement. Let's see where we can fit these meditations into a regular day. Perhaps at the end of PT when they're stretching, they do two minutes of meditation or before a meeting or when they're out on the range. You've got to work on your breath control anyway. This is a good time to practice breathing. Yoga is, I don't advocate being yoga, it's to replace physical training. That's not the idea, but it's something they could incorporate once a week or for 30 minutes or, or once a month for an hour. And and finding those ways to incorporate it in throughout the day. And then they could include during school house training more in depth, although, they have quite a bit to cover in the school house, but even an hour or two class on the benefits of yoga and meditation and breathing exercises. If people understand how their performance can improve and they could relate it back to different athletes or other elite teams than they will. If they understand that I can actually gain something from this. And even though it might be over a four, six week period, then they're more likely to take it on.

Scott:                   Well. Yeah, and I think, like you said, you can tie it to other things that make it easy. I mean, like I know we talked about it being a requirement, but that's probably a strong word. I mean, if you tied it to a part of your PT at the end or you know,

Benefsheh:          Yeah. And getting buy in from the leadership and not just the, the generals, but really like those squad leaders and team leaders. If they can see the benefit and they're doing it, it's more likely that they're, the, the rest of the soldiers will do it.

Scott:                   Well. Yeah. And that's interesting. I read a, I forget where I read this, but there was a sort of major somewhere that went to mental health every Friday for an hour. And he talked to, you know, the mental health doc and after like three or four times, the doc was like, Hey, why do you keep coming to me? You got nothing wrong. And he said to him, well, I come because everybody sees me come. And if I come and we just chat about sports or whatever, that's fine. But it's important that people see me come here and then they'll support them. This, we'll see that and support it. So kind of the same idea I guess.

Benefsheh:          I agree. And the army wellness center, they have a lot of really good resources that I feel are being under utilized. Maybe because people just don't know the services that they offer. But aside from just the, the nutrition and the physical assessments, they do offer a mental fitness and this is a free resource and it's like you can go there and not, it's not going to behavioral health or people might have the stigma of, Oh, there's something wrong with me. I can't go to behavioral health. The army wellness center is more in the prevention area. Not, Oh no, I have an issue. I have to go to behavioral health.

Scott:                   Yeah. And I think there's been some attempts early in my experience, I remember they started something when I was in Iraq and they made us all sit in a room. I mean it was like 200 of us sitting there shoulder, shoulder tight. And we had to do it by the 30th and it was like, man, this is the last place I want to be. You know what I mean? So that scar tissue has probably turned people off to the free stuff later on, if that makes any sense.

Benefsheh:          Yes it does. And that the military sometimes when they try to implement something it is like, Hey make it painful and then people are like, I'm never doing that again. And so I, I've been brainstorming like how could we make this fun but also informative. How could I inspire an 18 to 25 year old soldier, male or female to want to try meditation. And I, I had this like crazy idea. I woke up and the, I had just my Deadpool, I was dreaming like disturbing Deadpool all night and I woke up at like two or three in the morning and I was like, Ryan Reynolds, I want to work with Ryan Reynolds. How can I make that happen? It's almost like once he did of the Ryan Reynolds mindfulness project and just chronic, you know like did a YouTube series on his journey because he's hilarious and that his ability to just like dead pan stuff. I thought somebody would watch that. Like I would watch that could be entertaining and then...Then the person or the service member might be like, well he need try meditation because he's making it fun. Yeah. Not depressing.

Scott:                   Yeah. That's my experience. It seems like your is a lot of times the army took fun out of stuff and made it painful and then they wonder why people don't want to do it.

Benefsheh:          Exactly. Right. Paid meditation. It doesn't have to be so serious. I mean it, if I could just, I guess narrate the thoughts that go on in my head when I'm trying to tape that is not, is some funny stuff. So, I mean, and we all have these bizarre thoughts and it's just recognizing them and bringing our attention back to what it feels like to be sitting or if we're standing or if we're walking this sensation in the feet as they feel in the ground or the breath just bringing in just like, Oh I went off on Deadpool again, bringing the attention back to the present moment.

Scott:                   Sure. Well yeah, we talked a little bit about mindfulness and all this and so you were active duty and now you're retired. So can you talk a little about your transition and how you found it?

Benefsheh:          Yeah. So that, I honestly did not think that it would be, it's going to be a problem. I was ready to retire and there was no doubt about that. Like I wanted to spend more time with my kids and honestly I didn't want to be an O six Colonel cause I felt like all of the time, even more of my time, which is going to be taken up, sitting in meetings.

Scott:                   Yeah.

Benefsheh:          So I was ready to retire and I was very excited about it and I went to the transition assistance class and, and, and they are very useful, but I was like, I'm going to be stay at home mom and just volunteer because my husband's still active duty when, you know, that wasn't one of the options. So it was like just to get through the program you had to either complete resume, apply for school or do the business route. And so I, I felt obligated to do one of those things and I allowed myself to feel pressured to have to, to do something other than what I had planned. So that's why I went the business route and, and thought I would start the travel business. And I found a wonderfully, supported group and Gifted Travel Network. They did some coaching with me. It was just, what I realized was that it wasn't my passion and I was still depressed and it didn't even know I was depressed. I just was kind of in a funk and, and I had watched like all seven, however many seasons and the Sons of Anarchy in like five weeks. And it wasn't until I put on a pair of hiking boots to go for a walk. And then I stood up and I felt taller. I felt stronger, I felt more confident and I was like the boots, Oh my goodness, I miss my uniform. Like I didn't realize how much of my identity had been put into being a Lieutenant Colonel in the army and just go into work wearing the uniform until I didn't have it on anymore. And I, I went from active duty to retire, but also to being a spouse. And I wasn't comfortable with that. And that was my own personal ego because I was like, Oh, people aren't going to know what I've done. They don't know that it was also in the military. They're, they're gonna assume that I've been a spouse or that and that I've never worked. And it, that really bothered me. And I felt like the transition assistance program, this goes back again to the way that the military sometimes forgets the mental fitness didn't do anything to, to just even let me know that that might occur.

Scott:                   Right.

Benefsheh:          That mentally you're going to have to adjust as well as you are financially. And physically I, yeah, I wasn't prepared at all and so I, I did have to get some counseling to just help me transform through that and to realize, Oh, okay, so I don't have that anymore. I now need to find something internally that's going to create that confidence, create that or generate that confidence, generate that, that self assurance that I was getting from the military.

Scott:                   You're not the first person that I've interviewed that has said that and I experienced the same thing myself. It took me awhile. Even though I was ready, I was, I knew I wanted to get out. I had tried getting out twice before and had gotten stopped last one time and denied the second time. And I had a plan and I skipped all through. I didn't even go to any of the transition assistance program. I just, I knew what I was doing, but once I got there and like you said, not having the title and the place of work to go to and all that stuff, it was quite a shock. So took a little while.

Benefsheh:          I didn't even, I didn't even know what to wear. How uncomfortable in regular clothes.

Scott:                   Yeah. It's still aggravates me today. I go to the conferences for taxes or financial advising and people come into the meetings late and it's like I want to stand up and choke them out and be like, Hey, is, you know, three o'clock was three o'clock not three Oh five or something like that. So.

Benefsheh:          Well, and I have found that leading volunteers, which I, which I do in my community is a lot different than leading soldiers. And because they are volunteers, you can't choke them out. It's just a whole different set of skills that I'm learning.

Scott:                   Yeah, no, that's very common across the couple people I've spoken with that have transitioned. It's pretty interesting. The same stories. So you get back on your feet after you retired and you know, had a little bit of a down spell, you got on to Warriors at Ease. What does that all about?

Benefsheh:          So Warriors at Ease, I originally got on the board of Warriors at Ease through one of my really good friends and classmates. She was the executive director at the time and she asked me to be on the board and I love this organization. So it we're, we're bringing mindfulness practices, meditation and yoga to the military and to veterans. And we offer free yoga is basically our showcase and teacher training for yoga instructors that maybe aren't familiar with the military or, aren't familiar with how to teach yoga. That is trauma sensitive, yoga that is adaptive for people that are maybe missing limbs and just informed on military culture. And so we offer that, that teacher training because as I had said, the, the type of, some yoga instructors just don't have any background with the military and the wording that you, that they might use might not sit so well with a person that is suffering trauma. And so we talk about that and we train yoga instructors on how to lead classes that create secure environment, a safe environment for their clients or for their students. So the, the teacher training is one of our premier programs and then just offering free yoga in the community wherever we happen to have a teacher there that's a, that's teaching. We also have programs for mental health care professionals that aren't yoga teacher training programs, but teaching them or showing them how to do meditation classes that are are trauma sensitive.

Scott:                   Yeah. And then one of the, I guess more specific about what they do. They have, they teach yoga. Meditation.

Benefsheh:          Yes. So we, We train yoga instructors to bring yoga and meditation to military populations around the world. And that's how we're different from just a regular yoga studio. Regular yoga teacher is because we're focusing on military populations. Right. And we are able to teach classes to people that have had traumatic post traumatic stress or have had a traumatic brain injuries. So we meet, you have that, that knowledge. Our teachers have that knowledge. And then we do offer free yoga. So our teachers are teaching classes to the community Warriors at Ease classes. So and there and it's free yoga. And then we also have, we'll host retreats around there. A retreat was just hosted at Omega Institute in Rhinebeck, NewYork, which is for, for veterans. This one was for a women. They also have one that's just for men and, and these are fully sponsored retreats that are free for the veterans. And we have these different retreats throughout the year.

Scott:                   Sure. And I'll link to the website as well. But one of the things I noticed too is, is they also advocate to the VA and Department of Defense. I think to start working this in, into the choices for medical providers I guess is the right term.

Benefsheh:          Right. We do to advocate it as the comp part of a complimentary and alternative medicine approach to healing post traumatic stress and TBI. Absolutely. And, and working with the VA is very important that we do have connections with the VA and, and the different regional centers throughout the United States and just working with directly with department of defense too. So we've got some connections with different units that want to have this training as well. And, and not so much the, the yoga because these are active duty so they might not be yoga instructors, but giving the meditation training and mindfulness skills training, we do that as well.

Scott:                   Okay. And then I missed out, I should have done this from the start. Tell us a little bit about your background and how you got to where you are today.

Benefsheh:          Oh yeah. So well it really started, and this is where the book starts telling. My story is in 2008 I was teaching at West point and I had a, my son was two and a half and I was pregnant with my daughter. My husband was stationed at Fort Drum, so that's about six hour drive and it was based on our, our timelines. He's four your groups ahead of me. We just could not match up for, after we got married, it took about four and a half years to match up.

Scott:                   Wow.

Benefsheh:          Yeah. And I was struggling because I was by myself. I did have an au pair, but I had to work full time and also have two kids and I was just miserable. So when I was at work I would be thinking about my kids and if they were okay and and having had to drop my daughter six weeks old off at the day care. It's just like someone just take a knife into my heart. Or when I was at home, now I'm thinking about all the, the class prep that I didn't do or not prepared to teach class. I feel sorry for any kind of, or former cadets that I taught and so, and I was just angry. So West Point, the housing community was really very supportive and I didn't, I thought, so my perception initially it was a negative perception of this supportive community because I saw everybody with their husbands or with their spouses. Everybody was happy and it felt like they were just like Mayburry, they were doing synchronized lawn mowing, synchronized financing and here I am like with this dark cloud over my head gone and I'm just miserable. And I was angry and I was that way for quite some time and not sure how I found out about this yoga retreat, but there was a yoga retreat in Omega Institute in Rhinebeck, New York. And so I got my mom to come up and help the au, pair, watch the kids, and I went to that yoga retreat and that was the first time that I had the understanding that I could have a choice about how I choose to react. Like I didn't realize that that was an option. Like I would just react, didn't know that I could pause and choose how I wanted to react. I have a choice. And so that sparked the mindfulness of the beginning of the mindfulness journey. When I realized that I didn't have to be miserable, I was the one that could control my responses, my behavior. And so I started doing yoga more regularly. I started doing meditation in 2012 I eventually went to yoga teacher training and I, I've done some life coaching and, and all of that built upon itself and I learned various tools and skills. I mean, it's not like all my struggles ended. No, right. That, that, that, that doesn't happen. We still, I'm still on the journey, but everything became so much brighter. The learning to be present in the moment changed my quality of life. Like I did not realize how much time I spent thinking about past things or ruminating about something I said or something I did. Especially like if it was some sort of like sporting activity and I dropped the ball, like I was like, a mess for days afterwards because I felt like I had failed this intramural team already failed my, my team PT. Oh my goodness. So, but just getting out of that and now and, and not spending so much time in the future about, Oh my gosh, I have to do this presentation. And just like going over it like 17 times. No. So just staying present and it's, my quality of life improved a hundred fold. And that's why I was like, I want to write this book because had I known some of those things, perhaps I wouldn't have struggled as much. Not likely that my, all my struggles would've ended, but I would've had the mental tools to deal with them, which I, I had to learn it cause I didn't have that.

Scott:                   Cool. Okay. So as we're getting towards the end, we'll find a piece of advice. Could you give to listeners regarding mindfulness and meditation and or a general military career in general?

Benefsheh:          Well, for military career in general, I would say don't try to do everything on your own. I don't know. I think that, well at least for me, I felt that if I asked for help that that meant that I wasn't strong, that I wasn't capable and that people were gonna look at me as a failure. And that's ridiculous. I mean the, the, the military community is so supportive, especially the spouses. And I always had this like us, them mentality, I don't even know where that came from. But active duty women versus spouses and that's, it's pure garbage. We're just all trying to do the best we can. We're trying to raise our children and work wherever we are if it's at the office or at the home. And they, and so asking for help is just, it's, it didn't malleable and it's something that I, we don't do enough. I don't know if we, if it's our ego or whatever it is, but ask for help when you need it and don't feel any shame cause there is no shame in asking for help. And then as far as mindfulness and meditation, just, just try it. Don't take it so seriously. It's that two minutes on a timer and, and sit in a comfortable chair. You don't have to stay across like you don't, you do not have to chance. Just sit and concentrate on the breath. And if that's uncomfortable, you can concentrate on the sensation in the body. And, but two minutes is really all it takes. Two minutes of, of deep breathing, maybe counting. Inhaling for four, exhailing for four can activate the parasympathetic nervous system and calm the body down. And that's, that's all it tastes. Two minutes. It could start with that two minutes once a day. And I find that for me, trying to meditate 20 minutes in the beginning of the day is I'll be like, I don't have 20 minutes, but if I do, if I do two minutes and then just that little reminders throughout the day, I could do two minutes, 10 times a day. Just two minutes is like that. It goes so quickly. So yeah, there's just, just try it.

Scott:                   Good. Well thanks for coming on the show and if somebody wants to reach out and find out more about you, about mindfulness, about Warriors at Ease, your book, how would they do so?

Benefsheh:          Yes, Warriors at Ease. warriorsatease.org So the link for that you have a and then also going for my book, you can find in the show notes or email me at Benefsheh@militaryandmindful.com I love to just hear feedback from what you think about my book or just to chat, say hello or how I can help you in your mindfulness journey. So please do reach out.

Scott:                   Well good. Well thanks for coming on the show today.

Benefsheh:          Thank you so much for having me. It was a lot of fun.

Scott:                   If you enjoyed today's show and find Benefsheh advice, informative and inspiring, get a digital copy of your book, Military and Mindful online or on Audible. The print version will be available online and in stores in December. You can contact Benefsheh at Benefsheh@militaryandmindful.com. Schedule a free 20 minute coaching session to provide feedback on her book, or just say hi and please check out Warriors at Ease at warriorsatease.org. Thanks for listening.

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